Sample of interview... good stuff

James: I am sitting her with my wife Betty and with Beth Moore. I'm James Robison... We're talking about the things that break the heart of church members and Christians and believers and confuse people. How can people who are people of faith who love their family, how can they fail? But they do, they get in a pit; a pit of defeat and despair, sometimes they're so depressed they despair of life and sadly, sometimes they take other innocent people with them. And the consequences of sin is painful, not only to the person caught in it but to everyone else they touch in some way, innocent people suffer because people who have made bad choices made those choices. We want to help people get free... Beth, I feel like the things that break the heart of people when they see someone else fail, it puts us in a sense of dismay and disheartens a lot of people. I think somehow, if we can help people understand that the greatest among us, so to speak, are totally vulnerable to stumbling, to making the worst possible choice or to being a captive, a prisoner. The enemy may have a wooden gun stuck in our ribs but we don't know it is a wooden gun. And if he has convinced us then he can so often control us. He is controlling the actions of so many people, which is why I wanted us to spend this week talking about the best-selling book that God really impressed you to write. It is the best-selling book right now among all inspirational books as we're sitting here talking because people live in a pit of defeat and hopelessness; they want to get out. And when you put "from a former pit-dweller," I don't think you're for one moment implying that you could never get back in, but for the grace of God there all of us go. I think people are getting the book because they want hope. We're sitting here talking with a broken heart because we've seen so much that breaks our heart. We have experienced it ourselves and yet we have seen hope. We don't have to live here. I mean you made a statement here in the book and I want you to pick up on this because you're saying here that a stronghold is something we have, a pit is somewhere we live. The stronghold puts us there if only for a while. We can get out of this. It can be an addiction. You make it so clear that this is not where we have to live. I want you to just elaborate on that a little bit.

Beth: Talking about an addiction, I really do believe that there is a method to the madness of the enemy. He starts with a distraction, something that just gets us off course, gets us from looking at how huge our God is in our circumstances, gets us distracted by looking at the circumstance itself or the pain itself or the difficulty itself. Then it moves from that distraction -- distraction is not enough. What the enemy wants is for it to move into an addiction and even a thought process of defeat, unforgiveness, bitterness, resentment, lust, greed, all of those are addictive kind of thought processes. But that's not even enough for the enemy. He wants to take us on to full-fledged destruction -- from distraction to addiction to absolute destruction. But the thing about it is that anyone in Christ cannot be destroyed. We may be struck down but we have not been destroyed. You have never been knocked down so far you cannot get back up. It is a lie! And to think that this is it, there is never a way out of this hole --

James: Yet, if you don't get up, you're simply -- you're not dead, you're just believing a lie. You're believing I can't get up when the truth is you can get up and you have somebody that will help you get up. It is not just a matter of we're in the pit and we're knocked down. There is somebody waiting to get us out of the pit who is able to get us out of the pit and able to keep us out of the pit, and that's the thing we want you to understand. We don't have to live being trampled ground, walked over, stomped on, held down -- we don't have to live there. You may not realize it but it is a choice. You may have been thrust into the pit by circumstances and family but we don't have to live there. And Beth, somehow I pray that every person listening to us can come to understand where I am right now is not where I have to live.

Anyway, it was *quite* good... Here's the transcript. And if you want to watch it, click here and scroll to June 19th.

Overcoming bondage (Spirit and Truth)

There seems to be two major components to the Christian life that Jesus talks of in John 4:23-24, Spirit and Truth. I think these two are the keys for a life free from habitual sin bondage. And this only makes sense for freedom (John 8:31-32; 2 Cor. 3:17). Let me explain. Many people I know who are trapped in addiction as well as myself (roughly five years ago) often feel it is only through super-human strength that they will overcome. If they just could super-size their amount of determination and will power, then there battle would be over. And so they hear different messages preached and feel fired up and then fall before too long. They tried in their own strength to do what could only be done through the power of the Spirit while guarding one's minds with truth - ripping down the lies that have been preprogrammed and control/bombard the thought processes by oneself/the enemy. It is not enough to just know a truth like "____ is wrong." One needs to have the power to live in the truth rather than just acknowledge it in their head. Thankfully, Jesus told of the gift coming, the Spirit, that empowers Christians. It is only through radical surrenderment to the Spirit's control, living saturated in God's love and truth (the Scripture) and through real honest relating and relationship with Him that there is any shot of any kind of victory from sin bondages. And there are no short cuts around it. Jesus told His worshipers to worship Him in Spirit and Truth. His truth is what we anchor to regardless of what culture, friends, our own minds, the enemy, etc. say. And it is only through the annointing of the Spirit that His empowerment exists. To try to live the Christian life through one's own effort is not only impossible, it is anti-Biblical! Gal. 3 states as much - after starting with the Spirit are we now trying to reach our goal by human effort? Once one realizes that the whole battle for and to maintain freedom is through the power of the Holy Spirit (remember self-control is HIS fruit not self-produced) and through renewing the mind by holding to the truth (Rom. 12:2, John 8:31-32), they realize that they cannot be around every influence. Their thoughts ARE impacted by the negative influences around them. They realize just HOW dependant they are on the Word of God to strengthen their minds and it no longer becomes something to do out of guilt but an item of reading out of desperation to truly understand how to survive in this world to maintain freedom from habitual sin. And they have come to the end of self-sufficiency, because they know that it was not their willpower that set them free or allows them to maintain it, but rather the power of the Spirit through abiding in Christ (John 15). Unless one is dedicated completly to the Lord, but then gives up to His power at work in them, they should probably never expect to see any real change in their situation, because it is only through Him that there is any hope, and as I love to say, He is only found when sought with our whole hearts (Jer. 29:13). Is it worth it to lose everything to gain everything? I think so.

Jason Upton and the Antidote to Worry

So I'm really enjoying Jason Upton's Faith cd. I'm guessing I'd enjoy other ones too, but it seems like I'm kinda just locked in on that one for now. Anyway, here's a link to one of the songs if you want to start "tapping in" - as a friend calls entering the presence of God. I love the quote I heard - "If you can't tap into the presence of God with Jason Upton playing there's got to be something wrong with you." Not to insult you if, for some bizarre reason you don't enter His presence after listening for a bit, but man, this is some annointed music, imho.


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It seems as Christians we like to give people lots of dos and don'ts. Do love other people. Don't be prideful. Do evangelise. Don't worry. And so on. The problem is that no one seems to ever tell anyone how or how not to do these things. I remember hearing messages where I would hear a hundred verses on how pride is bad, and I walk out of church resolute that I would not walk in pride, before realizing that I was walking in pride to think that I could beat pride by simply my determination. I've heard messages on not worrying where it becomes so hammered home to not worry that I'm worried about whether I will walk in worry again. Suffice it to say while every now and again if someone is in open rebellion they need to hear a message like that, perhaps most of the time it is a lot more of a "how" issue. How do I walk in love? I already have read 1 Cor. 13 a few hundred times. I don't think reading it one more time is going to magically make me apply it. Conviction without empowerment for change seems to me to lead only to guilt, not any true transformation.

While I won't venture to solve all of these issues at once, I'm certain that as someone really starts to scour the Scriptures the "hows" do appear. However, as with Jesus parables, generally they are not right on the surface but involve careful reading as well as complete dependence on the Holy Spirit to enable us to understand the Word of God. However, much of these "how's" tend to be linked to straight tapping in to the power source. If there is a disconnect with my relationship with God, than how is His power going to be flowing through me? Man seems too often to try to figure out in our strength and power how to do what we were never meant to do except through His power. Unfortunately, too often the things hindering people from fully being free are things they are not willing to change - like idolatry, contentment with sin because of its enticement, unwillingness to ask for forgiveness from one they have wronged due to pride, resentment, greed, lust, etc. So they wonder why the annointing is not there, and it is because of the disconnect they have created by refusal to submit to the Lord or abide in Him (and yes, I am not talking about 10 minutes, we need radical saturation with the Lord, not just a slight tweaking - I'm talking being consumed - little time with Him = little power, As Joyce Meyer has said, "the annointing goes with the love-walk").

Once one gets to the point of desperation - and I do realize people often are always here, I'm just talking about that desperation being for the Lord and freedom and not misplaced - then they are truly ready to do whatever it takes to take control of the "how". While trying the "hows" while not being connected they tend feel frustrated because they are not experiencing the results. Ah, but the Bible is true, the problem is the disconnect that needs to first be changed and then firm, resolute desperate dedication to the Lord regardless of what one is experiencing - sounds a bit like "fixing our minds on things above and not earthly things" (Col. 3:1).

Anyway, here is an example of a "how" that the Bible talks of that God blessed me with the opportunity to preach on a few weeks ago. I called it, "The Antidote to Worry."

Phillipians 4:6-7 says, "Do not be anxious about anything, but in everything, by prayer and petition, with thanksgiving, present your requests to God. And the peace of God, which transcends all understanding, will guard your hearts and your minds in Christ Jesus."

Here we see that there are two mutually exclusive events, anxiousness and p,p, w/ t. There are a couple of things we should realize. #1. This is NOT a casual prayer like "God bless the meatloaf and take care of ______." This word for petition, or supplication as some versions have, is an INTENSE word. The Liberty Bible Commentary said it was "entreating, earnest pleading." It is hardly casual prayer like the type that sounds sweet and flowery but is more about sounding good to the people around then it is about talking to God. This is intense gut-level desperation to the Lord. It is militantly and boldly seeking the Lord in the situation through the power of the Spirit. When this Greek word is used elsewhere in cases of intense seeking like Luke 2:37 and 2 Cor. 9:14. Now after THIS kind of petitioning, comes thanksgiving. This kind of thanksgiving is not after the request is answered, rather it is before. It is included in with the petitioning. I'd venture to say it is the way we take thoughts captive while we trust and hope in the Lord about the circumstance. When the thought of worry comes to mind, we take it captive with truth, something like, "I thank you God for how this situation is in Your hands."

And THEN we see the answer to worry. It comes in the next verse, "And the peace of God, which transcends all understanding, will guard your hearts and your minds in Christ Jesus." It is HIS peace, not one we try to conjer up. Not the one that we try to do on our own and then give Him a token "thank you" for. No, that's man's way. God's peace "transcends ALL understanding." It guards our hearts and minds as we live in thankfulness and intense intercession over the issue.

I could give story after story of example of how this has occurred in my life, but this is getting long (feel free to ask me about them if you would like). Suffice it to say, I would say that a large chunk of answers to prayer God has blessed me with the opportunity to see have come as through God's Spirit, He enables me to do my part - p, p, w/ t - and He does what I can't do - guard me with peace and answers prayer in His time as He teaches me perseverance so that I may mature (James 1:2-4).

Oh, and here's an old school Disciple music video about this all that I just happened to be listening to.

Quote

"If you are not touching other people's lives with the light Jesus Christ gave you, you are hiding your light under a bushel. You can say, 'I'm not that type of a person, that's not my personality, I'm insecure, I'm shy, I'm just a quiet person.' ...God knew that you would be a quiet person, but God still designed works for you before the creation of the world. He still has works for you. Whatever that is, because of who you are, you will reach people that no one else will reach. Unless you shut down and think that you can't because someone has made you feel comfortable with doing nothing. The greatest temptation that will ever befall you that is common to man is the temptation to do nothing. And that temptation is over the majority of the church. God has created you to be like His Son who will love, deliver, and set free the captives. Set at liberty them that are bruised, that's who is in you and He's going to want to do it whether you do or not. And if you don't let Him do it through you, then you've imprisoned Him back in the box where He was freed from." -Doug Stanton

knowledge, pride, and the Holy Spirit

1 Cor. 8:1b-2: Knowlede puffs up, but love builds up. The man who thinks he knows something does not yet know as he ought to know.

It seems that as one starts to learn more spiritually, one of two things happen. They often become proud of what all they have learned, making a little of a false spiritual identity for themselves of what all they know, and cheapen the walk with God to nothing more than to a competition to show how bright they are.

Or:

They realize that just learning is only the beginning. To be able to apply what they know becomes more and more increasingly impossible. They realize just how dependent they are on God's Spirit to apply any of it, because they realize just how powerless they are to walk experientially in daily life in what they have learned. To walk in 1 Cor. 13 variety of love, to walk in humility, purity in heart and motives, etc. just to name a few things are ridiculously impossible to live in on one's own. Therefore, the knowledge they have gleaned becomes the way for the Spirit's power to be used coming through them, so that they may better reflect and minister to those around them.

I'm pretty sure I've done both of these before. God, let me live consistently in the latter!

1 Cor. 4:7b "What do you have that you did not receive? And if you did receive it, why do you boast as though you did not?"

Fear/bondage

I just read Nightmare Academy by Frank Peretti. So that book played into the thoughts of this post...

The lies that keep one stagnated in sin are just that - lies. One can even see the lies, but until they are willing to seek the Lord for inner healing, real honest relating with Him, and time in the Word to be empowered by the Spirit, one all too often feels powerless to do what they know to be true, or will only do it by sheer white-knuckling (of course, it should go without saying that one has to choose to embrace truth rather than live in the lie regardless of what their flesh argues). The lies have to get exposed. Lies like, "I'll never be free of this," "it's just too difficult for me to overcome," "but people might rejected me if I fail," "I can conquer __ by myself, I don't need anyone's help," "I can't burden someone else with any problem I am experiencing," "I can't do ____, because it would be just awful if ____ happened", "if I stopped doing this, what would ____ think of me," "I'll never get married to anyone respectable so I just have to settle for anyone," "God seems to like to work in other's lives but not mine," "what if I fail," "nobody could understand what I am going through," "what if I stay like this the rest of my life," "I can't trust God," "I could never forgive that person," "everybody else does ____ so it can't be that big of a deal," etc. The book Telling Yourself the Truth by Backus is a really good book for confronting the lies that hold one back. To confront the lies, one sees that all the lies were was a mirage. They are empty and cannot hold me back if the foundation for my life is truth rather than feelings, pride, or selfishness. There is freedom on the other side. God still loves me if I fail. He still has control of my future. He is taking care of my needs. I need not worry, for His hand is tightly on me. Who cares if people judge me? Does it really matter a whole lot? Why should that paralyze me from doing what I know is right? And if I can see how God has worked in the past I can start to see the beautiful path He has laid out for me. The Christian life has to be a life of taking thoughts captive to truth and trust as the Holy Spirit reveals the lies of the devil, the world, or my own flesh.

This is why reading the Bible is so critical. Not only does the truth demolish the lies (2 Cor. 10:3, John 8:32, 2 Cor), but repentance with knowledge of the truth is the way to freedom from the enemy as well (2 Tim. 2:25-26). And through this experiential - living out - knowledge of the truth, only through the power of the Spirit, are the strongholds decimated and freedom starts to be realized. While this cannot come through human effort (Gal. 3:3), it can only come through obedience, surrender, and abiding. As the mind gets upgraded through being renewed by God's Word and saturating in His presence, the transformation process occurs (Rom. 12:2, 2 Cor. 3:17-18), so that we outwardly reflect what has been saturated in us. The reality is that we tend to always reflect our surroundings, it is only from being around Him and people who are more serious about their walk with God than we are that that reflection in our life looks more desirable.

I'm convinced freedom in Christ is far more easy or difficult than we hope. Let me explain. It depends on whether we are approaching victory through man's thinking, strength, and techniques or through the Word of God. If we humble ourselves and do things His way... it will take everything we have, but will be far easier than we could have hoped. After all, His commands are not burdensome and His yoke is easy and His burden is light (1 John 5:3, Matt 11:28-30). It is the only the lie that makes us think it is impossible - which it is, of course, in our own strength and in our own strongholds/mindsets. God is patiently waiting for us to do things His way, rather than continue following the road that seems right to man but leads to death (Prov. 14:12, 16:25). He is the Way, the Truth, and the Life (John 14:6). May He receive glory from our lives.

dependence on God

I was talking to someone a while ago about a test of spiritual maturity. He was trying to come up with one. He said that it is quite hard to do. Does reading your Bible for a certain amount of each day count? Does praying for x amount of time count? But couldn't that be nothing more than guilt compelling a person rather than real relationship with the Lord? What about exercising spiritual disciplines? Is someone who fasts more often than someone else more spiritual? Then the Pharisees who showed off their fasting for all to see would rank highly. Church attendence could mean something... unless the church is essentially dead. And to base something like this off of spiritual knowledge does not work either. Otherwise, the Pharisees and teachers of the law again would have ranked high.

Here's what I think (and I could be way off - its just the thought currently going through my mind). I think spiritual maturity is based off of dependence on God. It is coming to realize just how truly weak I am on my own and depending on God to change me and enable me to live a life in the Spirit. A spiritually immature person is one who depends on God for salvation alone. It does not matter if they are Ph. D.'s at seminaries. As far as applied spiritual growth goes, they are no better than one who just prayed to receive Christ - in fact, probably worse, because they probably have a tremendous amount of spiritual pride due to their intellect that very well could permanently stunt their spiritual growth.

As one grows they start to trust God for more and more, not just for strength and perseverance, but empowering, inner healing, victory over addiction/habitual sin, deliverance from the enemy, health, peace of mind, evangelistic opportunities - but I think someone more familiar with how weak they are without the Spirit starts to realize they not only need the opportunity, but that they are probably too weak to obey the Spirit's prompting to share, so they pray for the Spirit to guide their words. Then they realize the divine appointment, the right words from the Spirit, etc. are not enough, they need the Spirit to allow the other to be receptive. And the more one grows in their walk with Christ the more they realize just how truly weak they are on their own, and just how incredible the Holy Spirit is to us. Each aspect of growth in the Christian life becomes an unplugging of ourselves from dependance on ourselves or something of this world and then a replugging back into God. Until all we know is that our default mode for every circumstance, condition, or event is to go to Him. And perhaps this is what is meant what the Bible talks of praying without ceasing or abiding in Christ (John 15). Like capilaries in a human body every part of us connects into a part of Him. The Christian life is not about learning as much facts as I can, but rather be so intertwined with the Lord that people do not see where we end and He begins. God, move me to this place!!